The Root Of The Science Podcast
*Disclaimer: The views expressed by the guests in the podcast episodes do not reflect my own*
The Root Of The Science Podcast
EP 167: Albert Mutangiri, Can Tech Save the Bees That Feed the World?
When we think of bees, we rarely imagine them meeting technology. Yet for Albert Mutangiri, a lifelong beekeeper and CEO of Blue Bean Software, innovation and nature go hand in hand.
In this episode of the Root of the Science Podcast, host Anne Chisa explores HivePulse, a smart monitoring system that uses sensors and data analytics to track hive health, boost pollination, and strengthen food security.
Albert shares how his passion for beekeeping led to creating a globally used agri-tech platform that’s reshaping sustainable farming.
Follow the show on:
Twitter: @Rootofscipod
Instagram: @Rootofscipod
YouTube: The Root Of The Science Podcast
Facebook: The Root of The Science Podcast
LinkedIn: The Root Of The Science Podcast
Website
So I wanted to build a small little gadget and device that I could put inside the hive and see how that works. And then that started around 20 2015 or 2016, if I remember correctly. So that's that was the initial, you know, um uh uh uh purpose for hive pulse, which uh obviously has evolved over time and we've ended up building a platform that's I think used globally at the moment. Um so if I get into the details, so basically what the sensor does is that it it collects things like humidity and temperature of the hive, uh, the which is the internal. So honeybees are well known for regulating their internal dynamics, uh, which is the humidity and temperature inside the hive. They go 35 degrees to 60 percent humidity.
SPEAKER_01:And um, we also on the device itself we kind of embedded a temper sensor uh to combat theft and vandalism because hello everyone and welcome back to another episode of Roots of Science Podcast with your girl Anne with an E. If you are new here, welcome. Remember to hit the subscribe button if you're watching on YouTube or if you're listening to us on our audio platforms, remember to also subscribe and definitely share this episode. So let's get into today's episode. When a bee buzzes near you, your first thought might be to SWAT it away. But have you ever thought about how much of our food depends on bees? Or what happens when those tiny pollinators disappear? In today's episode, we explore while protecting these tiny pollinators might just protect us all. Today, we'll be talking to Albert Mutangini. He is the CEO of Bluebean Software and the creator of Hive Plus, which is a smart beehive monitoring device. He is a lifelong beekeeper, and Albert is passionate about urban beekeeping and using technology to make life easier, safer, and more productive for bee production. Let's get into today's episode. Hello, Albert. Welcome to the show.
SPEAKER_00:Hi, Ann. How are you doing?
SPEAKER_01:I'm good. I'm good. So happy to have you on today.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, thanks. Thanks so much for having me.
SPEAKER_01:Okay. So, Albert, for those who might not know who you are, could you kindly tell us a bit about yourself and really start the story for us on what inspired you to focus on urban beekeeping?
SPEAKER_00:Okay, cool. My name is Albert Mtangi, and I am uh well, I am uh an avid beekeeper. I'm the founder at Bluebeam Software, um, which is a software engineering company based in South Africa. Um, yeah, so actually, it's a very interesting story with beekeeping for me. Uh it's a hobby of mine. So it started when I was still a little kid. So I grew up in Zim. That's where I come from. And uh I started there. Uh my uh my parents are still there. And um uh the story is about when I was about four years old, um uh my siblings were a little bit older than me. They would go to school and and uh I'll stay around with my my moms. My moms used to grow a lot of uh pumpkins, so pumpkin um uh different varieties of pumpkins, so in the remote rural areas. So I would spend a lot of my time actually playing around and uh and and watching the bees go in and collect pollen and and these yellow big flowers kind of inspired me when I was still a little kid. And uh I think I had that passion since then. So uh fast forward about 30 years, uh 30, 35 35 years, when I was about 30, yeah, 35 35 years fast forward. I I I had a uh backyard tree, um, a gum tree that was flowering every springtime, and I decided to put a hive there, and that that's how it started. Yeah, so before you know it, and now you have about I've got about 20 hives.
SPEAKER_01:I got there. So what when you say you put a hive, uh, could you explain for some of us who who don't know what it is? I mean, I've seen a beehive, but what do you mean when you say you put a hive in a tree?
SPEAKER_00:Okay, so look, I mean, so uh with bees, you you have to obviously have a uh have a colony, a colony of bees, which is a swarm of bees that needs to move inside uh so honey bees in urban areas usually they because the the the populations of you you know us as humans, we've obviously occupied the urban areas and and most of the forests have been sort of decimated and uh and bees don't have anywhere to to nest or or create nests. So bees are constantly looking for for suitable nests to to to to grow their brood. So basically. So so you will see that a lot of uh urban areas, a lot of bees go into houses, like they'll go into chimney and form a nest there, and and people are always looking for someone to remove them. So what I did is that I just put a beehive. I went and bought a beehive actually, uh a Kenyan beehive. It's a it's uh it's one of those uh long um uh horizontal hives. Um uh so there's different types of hives I'll explain to you a little bit later on. But uh, bought that one, I put it in my backyard, and uh did a little bit of some research and uh found out that you can actually attract bees using uh lua called uh lemongrass oil. So I put a couple of drops of lemongrass oil in there, and then one weekend I was actually lucky to to witness the whole event. So a swarm of bees, plus or minus 60,000 plus, I don't know, uh uh bees like descended on my hive, and and I was really excited. I captured the whole event on camera actually. So that was my first first hive, yeah.
SPEAKER_01:That's so brilliant. Um, it's pretty exciting. So why did you think okay, I need to have a bee, a beehive, apart from your interest and the hobby for someone who's listening, it's like like Albert, why why do why do bees actually matter? Um, I see them, like you said, they come into my house, they sometimes sting me and it hurts, but like, why does it matter for you to have these 60,000 uh bees or the colonies, I mean the hives that you already have?
SPEAKER_00:Okay, cool. So interesting part of it is that I think um uh you know there's one equation to it, right? Pollination is gonna is go to food security. So if we without bees, definitely, I mean, we we as humans we don't have we won't have the food that we we we eat on a daily basis. You see, bees pollinate 75% of our crops, which we eat and uh include fruits, vegetables, gnats, seeds, and the like. So if we don't have bees, I mean the yield and the crop quality suffers, and uh um and obviously that will shoot the prices for food, you know. Uh so it's really crucial for a lot of people to actually understand that actually most of most of our food really is the food that we eat on a daily basis highly dependent on pollination from bees. All the other notes is like you know, there's the economic value of it, you know. If you look at the whole value chain, um uh from beekeeping to the guys that are making the hives, you know, I mean that's that's something that if you're a farmer um and you uh have uh hive and you can sell some of the excess of honey that you make, I think that's also um uh a lucrative business model, if I would say it that way.
SPEAKER_01:Well, honestly, it's it's a win-win for us, for the ecosystem as well as for the farmers. This this really, you know, you've painted that picture for us. So um let's speak practical terms, right? So if somebody is like you and they might have this interest, what are some of the first steps for somebody who's living in the city or wherever to have a beehive in their backyard, balcony, or in their rooftop?
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, it's quite a complicated case, actually, surprisingly. When I when I started with my hive, I didn't know that there's actually city buy-in laws that uh prevent you from having a hive in your backyard. So so there's one key uh factor you need to consider here is actually in urban areas, uh heavily populated areas, you uh the legal laws don't allow you to have a hive in your backyard uh or in the roof per se. So you have to apply for a permit. So you apply to the city um uh city council for a permit to have beehives on your in your backyard, and they will come to your hive uh house actually and inspect your house and go look at your backyard. Is there enough space between you and your neighbors? So there's a bit of some some some uh you know uh some of these uh technologies that you have to go through initially. So, but once you have the license and then um or or the permit, if I would say it that way, then it's fairly easy actually have a hive. Usually they give you an option to have one hive only because the you know our African honey bee is is quite defensive when it's got honey, so it's most likely during this springtime that the bees are you know a bit defensive because they they protect their honey. So you don't want your neighbor getting stung, you know, if you have a beehive in your backyard, so something like that. So the practicality, so I'd say that's one thing that you need to do. The second thing is that you need to have uh at least the tools to maintain a hive, you know. Um you need to have uh a bee suit, you know, always protect yourself whenever you're uh working on bee, bee bees, um, and the like, and then you need also the tools like hive two, uh the hives, and all those other things that in the in the smoker, by the way. So uh you know, you need to to to to to to smoke your bees we uh before you actually open the hive. Uh this basically it's a process for making them calm. So there's this story that if you you know um uh bees have instinctively uh you know grown this this trait that if it's if it's uh if it's burning outside or there's a fire coming and they they just get into this mode where they they they'll consume as much honey as possible so that they can fly away. So so once they yeah, so once they gorge themselves on honey, they they're not interested in stinging you. You know, become sluggish, you know, that kind of thing. Yeah. So you need a set of tools to actually you know work the hive. So so I I would say those are the pretty much, you know, um basic, basic tools to get get you going.
SPEAKER_01:That's so interesting. I think sometimes, well, I'm learning a lot here, and I'm sure our listeners listening to some of these things, we are learning as well. Um, it's quite interesting that you say that you need to have a permit, which makes a lot of sense, uh, especially for some of us who might live in apartments, etc., and we don't have um space. So you work on a farm, so that's why you're able to have as many hives as you do, right?
SPEAKER_00:True, very true. So I I stayed in Johannesburg for quite a while before I moved here in uh in in KZN. Um yeah, but initially I had my hives in my backyard because I had permit to have the hives in the backyard. We had quite a bit of a uh a bigger space where we could actually put our hives in. So yeah.
SPEAKER_01:Okay, interesting, interesting. So um, Albert, the wonderful thing is that you are at the core, you are into you know software and you are you actually created um Hive Plus, which is a smart bee monitoring device. So um you've kind of you know created something really cool from just your passion. So, how does Hive Plus work in terms of uh monitoring the beehives?
SPEAKER_00:Okay, cool. So the I think the like thanks, you mentioned the passion side of things. So initially, my goal was to try and um provide uh build a set of tools that will you know assist beekeepers in doing their job, you know. Um honey beekeeping is is it's quite cumbersome. It's it's it's a it's a it's a hands-on job. You have to be a lot of people think that you know, if I have a hive, I'm just gonna leave it in the backyard, it will do its own thing. But it involves a lot more if you want to be, if you want to make sure that depending on what your use case is like, if you want to make honey or you want to do pollination services and the like and the like. So you're gonna need to constantly monitor your hive and how it's doing. So um my passion initially was to build a tiny small sensor that I could stick into the hive, and it will tell me a lot more information about how my hives are doing without me being invasive, being opening the hive. Because every time you open the hive, you are actually exposing the hive to the elements, and the bees have to re-build and close it off. So they use propolis, which is uh the sticky stuff that they take from uh that they they collect or uh harvest from trees, um, and they use this to seal the hive so that at least uh the external elements like weather conditions are cold doesn't come inside. So the less invested you are to your hive, the better, you know, for them. So I wanted to build a small little gadget and device that I could put inside the hive and see how that works. And then that started around 2015 or 2016, if I remember correctly. So that's that was the initial, you know, um uh uh uh purpose for hive pulse, which uh obviously has evolved over time, and we've ended up building a platform that's I think used globally at the moment. Um, so if I get into the details, so basically what the sensor does is that it it collects things like humidity and temperature of the hive, uh, the which is the internal. So honeybees are well known for regulating their internal dynamics, uh which is the humidity and temperature inside the hive, they go 35 degrees to 60 percent humidity. And um, we also on the device itself, we kind of embedded a temper sensor uh to combat theft and vandalism because a lot of you know, if you have your hive sitting somewhere else in the remote area, uh someone is gonna come and pick it up and go use it and go use it for pollination services, which is kind of crazy. But uh the idea was around that. So uh the sensor itself, the initial version I built myself was kind of a POC that I just set in my backyard. I think I didn't have so much to do at that time, uh, just before COVID came in, and I had plenty of time on my hands, so I I kind of built this tiny module. I think I still have the version here with me. So I'm not sure if you'll be able to see it, but uh yeah, it looks more like that. So it's uh it uses off-the-shelf hardware that you can buy off the shelf. So I bought a bunch of small components off the shelf and I put it together. It's got a transmitter which transmits data over very long distances, so about a kilometer uh um uh uh distance, uh with line of sight, obviously. And then um uh it's got a humidity and temperature sensor on, it's got a gyroscope on, uh, and then it's got um it works with this tiny micro control uh microcontroller or computer, the computer chip itself on its on its own. It's a very small, tiny uh device uh called an 80 tiny 83. So uh with those uh components, I kind of build the platform initially from a hardware standpoint, and then uh build the software also that enables you to view the data that's coming from the from the hive. So that combined with that, we we kind of thought down the line to say I think there is a ton of challenges that be keepers faced currently. Why can't we actually build a product around this? So we went full scale, we kind of hired a whole team to get this thing done. So that's since I think for the past five years, that's what we've been doing.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah. Wow, that's brilliant. You found a problem and you created um a solution that's being used globally. So is this an app or is it something that's on on a computer?
SPEAKER_00:Um correct Chris. So so our application, like I said earlier on, it's uh it consists of two key components. One is the hardware. So hardware we talk of things like um things like hive markers. So we got something like this. This is a hive marker, uh, it's got uh QR code on it, and it's got an NFC embedded chip on it. Okay, but on the back of the side of it, you can actually write, it's writable. So you can use um any um uh marker that you can erase uh because we we kind of felt like uh uh you know, as a beekeeper, most of the guys use a small little book where they write their notes. You know, what I did on this hive on this particular date. So, what we do is that we provide them with this set of tools that will make their life a little bit easier. So they can write at the back here and they scan this uh with the app, with the mobile app, and then we create a timeline. So a timeline of events for all the hive inspections that you've done. Uh, and that information gives you sort of a highlight of what happened. So you can track if issues, like if there's issues, you can you can always go back and say, you know what, I did this on this particular date, and this is uh sort of a record-keeping uh item. And then the I think I didn't show you the actual device itself. So the actual device is like this one. This is the the the production ready uh uh device, and it's certified to to sell in Europe and in South Africa as well. Um and we uh basically the the concept I've got the the the actual frame of honey here with me.
SPEAKER_01:So it's a honeycomb.
SPEAKER_00:This this is uh not sure if you'll be able to see. I do so this is a frame of uh this sensor on the high uh on the on the frame like that. So creating that um uh attachment to the frame, and we put it in the brood nest. And then what it does is that you won't even notice that there's a sensor inside. Uh the bees just most probably propolize it. And um, but basically every 15 minutes we we we we pick uh we we we we read recording, um we read um uh measurements for temperature and humidity inside the hive, and then we transmit that data to uh our backend, which sits on the cloud on the cloud, um, and you can have access to that data either via a mobile device or via your desktop, normal desktop web browser. And that information is really crucial because what we're doing with that information is that we we sort of have a machine learning model that we created. This machine learning model understands the hives that are not doing well and the hives that are doing well uh using the data that we're collecting. So if um if we know that the hive is not doing well and needs intervention, you can literally just go and focus on that hive, those hives that are not doing well, you're gonna open those and either you know if they need more uh more storage or they they're running out of resources and things like that, it could feed you know a sugar syrup. Um, or if there is an issue with um with pests and diseases like thyroid mites and things like that, you can also intervene from that angle as well. Yeah. So our app kind of works with the hardware side of things and then the software, which is available on the mobile app and the web application.
SPEAKER_01:This is so brilliant. Um, and I think it also gives a lot of ease for someone who's still learning um for and wants to get into this. Because I'm just thinking, like you said, with the artificial learning side where it collects the data, does it, like you said, it it allows people to it tells them um the specific intervention? So if it's if it is a disease or a pest problem, does it give advice as well on on how they should be able to handle it?
SPEAKER_00:Good question. So what we're trying to do is uh with this set of tools that we're building for beekeepers, is that we we want to integrate the whole community into it. So it's not it's not just beekeepers. So we want to get I think I think we want to get growers involved, we want to get uh um uh pollinators involved, we want to get everybody else who is part of the beekeeping community to be part of the initiative, obviously. So it started with the hardware, which is the sensor, but the the end goal for us is like really long term, it's more of building this community of interconnected, you know, um uh uh communities. But they if I, for example, if I harvest my honey from my my my appiary on this particular location, but using our technologies and tools, we can easily tell the source of that honey where it's coming from. And we can also tell you the the the forage in that particular area, like what kind of trees are your bees uh collecting nectar from, uh based on the you know uh the forage feature that we have on the platform, which kind of highlights the the the the the the the forage, the type of trees that you have in that area and the pollen and nectar value, you know. So we record a lot more than just just the the humidity temperature sensor portion of it. So it it kind of I'm not sure if I answered your question though.
SPEAKER_01:No, you have. It seems like a very holistic um uh device and system, which is absolutely brilliant. You spoke about um a community, and this follows on to my next question, right? Um, what kind of support is available for someone who's interested in beekeeping or the agritech side? Um talk to me about that kind of community support because like like you already um insinuated that it requires a lot of input from so many people uh to make this work.
SPEAKER_00:I think the first thing that I would say if if you if you're if you're a beekeeper and you want to get into beekeeping, first thing is is uh learn, uh learn as much as you can. There's so much information on over the internet these days. I when I started uh with my first hive, I just went online. I went to YouTube and I said, okay, how do I do this? Uh I subscribe to a bunch of uh uh community members who have been doing beekeeping for years, and they've got a ton of information that kind of uh got me going initially. But uh I know uh uh there is initiatives in the uh non-governmental organizations that are kind of um running these initiatives where they empower, for example, I know one for women specifically in South Africa where they go into communities um uh and they give them a bunch of hives, and once they give them a bunch of hives, then they can actually you know um learn to do beekeeping and they'll sell that that honey back to the to the to the to the uh NGO or something like that, you know. Okay. So there is all these initiatives that uh either government-funded or non-government organizations, or if you just like an individual like myself who's keen on beekeeping, I think the thing is let's just start. You know, uh if you just start with one hive, usually I recommend start with two hives because you can compare, you know, what's happening on this hive and what's happening on this three, it helps a lot more. And then um I would recommend YouTube. Uh, if you don't have access to YouTube, there is options to join communities like Sabio. I think Sabio is one of the biggest communities in South Africa, specifically in South Africa that I know, that um has got a huge community of beekeepers and either hobbyists, commercial beekeepers, or um, or guys that are in the you know uh who are interested in the whole supply chain of of bee equipment, be beekeeping, and you name it. So I think that would be the starting point for for for someone who's kind of keen into into into that kind of uh into into beekeeping or who's passionate about it.
SPEAKER_01:Brilliant. I'm glad that there is a lot of support and community support. So if you're listening to this and you've been inspired, definitely go and check out those resources. So, Albert, let's talk about some of the maybe not so nice times or some of the challenges. And specifically, um, you've been doing this for a very long time. If you could go back, what advice would you give to yourself when you were just starting uh versus what you know now?
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, if I can tell you, I mean, product development is hard, incredibly, incredibly hard.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah.
SPEAKER_00:I think look, like I said, we're a technology company, we've got about maybe 30 engineers on the team. Um, that's what pays the bills, that's the bread and butter for us. We the product development is uh, you know, it's a it's a it's a division within the company. So we're trying to build, like again, like I said, we were trying to build find uh issues within the uh particular industries and we go build a solution for that. But uh look, we're technology technical people. I mean, I'm a technical person, uh, suck with marketing and all that other stuff. So uh so I we can build stuff, but again, with product development, you have to, there is a lot that is involved, and just you could build a fantastic product, but you also need to be able to scale that product, you need to also to be able to distribute it. So I think we've we've learned a lot of lessons from that particular experience. But one thing that I'll just say if if I'm going to give uh advice around this is I think persistence, patience, and and passion is unbeatable. So so uh usually the if you're gonna win, you're gonna have to just be persistent in in what you're doing, uh, whatever it is, you know. Um I'm one uh one guy who's really persistent. And like I said, I mean this started as a hobby, but we do have a um uh um a customer base across the globe. Uh there is people using our platform uh in the US, uh in Europe. Um uh one of the things that I didn't mention, our platform actually just works without you you don't have to have the the tools that I showed you now, like the the the sensor and uh you can just go in register and actually use it as a record keeping or a record keeping tool for you can create your hives. Once you create your hives, you can have uh forage also as well, which is also a component you can when you do harvesting so it's it's quite it's quite diverse.
SPEAKER_01:So speaking about the divine the device and um it's a bit all the things that it's able to do, um, how is somebody able to purchase it? Um where can they get either the physical hardware or just the software? How can they get hold of that stuff?
SPEAKER_00:Okay, so we've got a very similar pro similar process to uh for a new user who wants to use or someone who wants to try our tech. So you can go to our website, which is uh hivepalse.corz a forward slash um shop. Um there you've got a list of all the options that we have. So a registration at the moment is actually you can register for free, I think if I understand correctly. Um and then depending on the number of hives that you have, then you get charged for for that. So we've got kind of different tiers. Um and if you want to uh go into the advanced more uh options, which is obviously owning uh uh the hardware, which is the sensors, you can uh buy them online. We can actually we we just ship directly to you. So all you just need is depending on connectivity, uh, I don't want to get too a bit too technical about it, but but I can if you if you if you want me to. But um we've got two technologies that we support. Uh, and one of them is that you just have the device itself and you stick it in the hive, it works. You don't need anything else. And then for guys who are in commercial farms, growers, uh, those ones have got a quite a complicated uh uh use case and setup. So usually we give them what we call gateways or concentrators. So it's like this device that you mount outside with an antenna on.
SPEAKER_01:Okay.
SPEAKER_00:Um that allows uh as many devices on a particular site, but we can cover a radius of about maybe five kilometers from the that particular concentrator. So the devices will talk to the concentrator and then the concentrator sends that data to our cloud. So that's basically just uh it can get a little bit complicated from from when depending on the use case. But for hobbies, beekeepers who are in urban areas, it's just a matter of uh you know buying this this this module online and we ship it directly to you. You can register on our website for for free, and then uh depending on the data that you use and things like that, then we we charge you for that.
SPEAKER_01:Okay, so we'll also put all of your details for people to um click on the link so that they can get more information um about the different types of products that they would prefer. So um it does sound very seamless. Albert, we've had such a wonderful conversation, and as we wrap up, what is the vision for for you and Hive Plus five, 10 years from now?
SPEAKER_00:Okay, like I said, like I hinted earlier on, I think like we've we want to grow this into a community-based model where it's not just small pieces like the hardware, you know. I have a sensor inside my hive, but we we're interested in things like traceability of honey. Where is the honey coming from? Uh, so that's really crucial for us. We're looking at the grower side of things. So building the whole uh community of growers, like the guys who are doing um avocados, the guys who are doing macademias, the guys who are doing citrus, all those guys have got big uh uh pieces of land which are you know obviously under irrigation and things like that, highly dependent on the pollination side of things from specifically from bees. So we want to bring those on board as well. Uh, we're already working with growers, by the way, that are actually uh pilot testing our platform, specifically in the pollination space, because um, you know, they're highly dependent on honey bees for to for their yield and their production uh side of things. Uh, and then we're also looking at, I think we we're looking at
SPEAKER_01:um uh going into other markets that we haven't you know haven't tried yet uh i think africa is a big one for us uh uh uh ua e uh australia and new zealand we're also trying to get into there as well uh you know so so there is a lot that's that's staked up for us from a technical standpoint we we're constantly building we're not we're not stopping so yeah yeah if if I can summarize it that way I think there's a lot more that's coming up uh that uh we want to try and improve the product long term it sounds really really exciting and I wish you all of the best I've learned so much and um I can't wait to see from the outside all the amazing things that you're going to be doing thank you so much for taking time to chat with me today thanks uh and thanks for having me and to everybody else who's tuned in thank you so much for listening to another episode of Ritual Science Podcast with your girl and with an E. Until next time goodbye
